[html5] <article> for ecommerce product?

Richard Summers Richard.Summers at bbc.co.uk
Thu Jul 21 02:47:41 PDT 2011

Hi Yukka,

I agree with your assertion that the nesting of <article> tags does not feel
like the best way to deal with user-submitted content (comments in response
to an article).

I feel that a <response>, or <comment> element would provide valuable
distinction between the original article, and the user-submitted responses.

At the BBC, we do not currently display user-submitted comments to News
article's as nested elements of the main Article container, they appear
further down the page structure. I understand this goes against the
principal of semantic nesting, but it isn't so different from un-nested form
<label> and <input> elements. Perhaps an <article name="article_name"> and
<response to="article_name"> relationship could be considered?

In the context of a syndication harvester, we would want to make a solid
distinction between the reporter/journalist created Article, and the
public/user created Comments - as there may be legal issue's around
syndication of public/user created Comments.


Rich Summers 
Senior Client Side Developer
Social Publishing Platform
BC4 D6
Future Media & Technology
BBC Broadcast Centre
201 Wood Lane 
London W12 7TP

On 20/07/2011 17:49, "Jukka K. Korpela" <jukka.k.korpela at kolumbus.fi> wrote:

> 20.07.2011 15:01, Dominic Morgan wrote:
>> This is where I start to have issues with the spec. Are the contents of
>> an <article> tag supposed to make sense out of context or not?
> The contents of <article> element is supposed to make sense out of
> context, and this is an essential part of the meaning. At least this my
> understanding of the prose. The <article> element is effectively
> <syndicatable>, but that's too long a word. I guess.
>> To me a
>> "user-submitted comment" is not a "self-contained composition".
> It usually isn't. This is where things get too wild, perhaps. A blog
> post (by a blogger) is expected to be self-contained, syndicatable. But
> comments might me just "Me too!" or "You got it wrong in paragraph two,
> because...", which surely aren't standalone.
> I think <article> elements should be nested only in rare cases, where
> the inner elements are self-contained too. Sometimes a blog comment is
> syndicatable, perhaps more valuable than the original post. But blindly
> marking up all comments as <article>, as the current version suggests
> more or less, goes far too far.
>> Outside
>> the context of the original post it often makes little or no sense at
>> all. The clarification about nesting goes some way to addressing this
>> but not far.
> Now that you say it, it looks rather evident. The question remains which
> markup should be used for blog comments. By answer is to use <div> at
> present. It is better to be semantically empty than semantically all
> wrong. What would happen if a syndication harvester got zillions of
> "article elements" containing just "Me too!"?
> Alternatively, the spec could say that an article element inside an
> article element is not necessarily (or usually, to be honest)
> self-contained and syndicatable. The question then arises: What _is_ it?
>> I suspect that
>> the reason blog and news posts are used as examples is that they fit
>> more intuitively with the name of the tag rather than that the scope of
>> the element is limited to them.
> Quite possible; a blog post is an "easy" case, too. But examples should
> really help to understand the meaning better, not state the obvious. A
> difficult task indeed; it is more difficult to present good examples (or
> to set a good example) than to present good theories (or rules).

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