[html5] Using <section> and <h1> … Theoretical?

Lewis Dexter Litanzios / ldexterldesign mail at ldexterldesign.co.uk
Sun Jun 1 08:33:54 PDT 2014

Hey Ian,

Your suggestion makes writing _portable_ mark-up difficult, which I 
thought we were moving away from with the introduction of sectioning elems?

For example I could create the following mark-up in one section of my 
website and use it on another page, where the heading may need to be a 
h2 instead of a h1:

         <p>Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipisicing elit.
    Minus, tempore, dolorum, beatae a repudiandae obcaecati officia
    placeat ab iusto vero nobis eveniet distinctio dolor totam laborum
    recusandae dolore repellat eos.</p>

... rather than simply using h1 site wide and knowing where ever I 
include it - providing it's sectioned - my mark-up snippet will nest 
nicely into a sensible document outline, I now have to worry about 
heading details :/

Where can I reference browser support for outline algorithm - I did 
think it came with the html5 doctype?!


On 12/05/2014 23:36, Ian Hickson wrote:
> On Fri, 9 May 2014, Micky Hulse wrote:
>> Ok, so, W3C is changing the language, but what is WHATWG doing (or, have
>> plans to do)?
> As you pointed out, some people are "hating" on <section> and <h1> and so
> on. It's not really clear to me why; the concerns haven't really been well
> explained IMHO. There's no plan to change any of this in the WHATWG spec.
> (I'm especially confused because this style actually comes from XHTML2,
> which was championed by the W3C.)
> One thing to bear in mind is that in legacy browsers that don't support
> style sheets, and in some accessibility tools that haven't yet been
> updated to match the HTML spec, the "<section>" elements are "invisible"
> (unknown, treated like <div>). This leads to the <h1>s being treated as
> page headers in those UAs. To avoid this problem, while we wait for
> support to be more widely available, my recommendation is to use <h2>-<h6>
> with <section>, as in:
>     <h1>...</h1>
>     <section>
>      <h2>...</h2>
>      <section>
>       <h3>...</h3>
>       ...
> ...instead of:
>     <h1>...</h1>
>     <section>
>      <h1>...</h1>
>      <section>
>       <h1>...</h1>
>       ...
> The spec defines these as semantically identical, precisely to enable this
> transition period. We'll be able to use the <section>/<h1> style without
> even this trouble eventually. If you're not interested in targetting those
> browsers (e.g. you're just writing something for your own use) then I
> wouldn't worry about any of this.

ldexterldesign logo <http://www.ldexterldesign.co.uk/>
Lewis Dexter Litanzios
Web Designer & Developer
mail at ldexterldesign.co.uk <mailto:mail at ldexterldesign.co.uk>
+44 7504 907 304
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