[whatwg] Re: modal and modeless windows
karlhp at karlhp.com
Tue Jun 28 00:41:20 PDT 2005
Matthew Raymond wrote:
> Karl Pongratz wrote:
>> Matthew Raymond wrote:
>>> So I ask you, for this example, where is the benefit of modal
>> I am using the current approach you describe, and as long as you have
>> only a single additional window (the edit form) open it wouldn't be a
>> problem, except if you want the user to explicitly complete a task,
>> then modal would be required.
> I'm going to be lazy and ask you to provide the use case, since
> you're the one claiming one exists in the first place.
> > In case of the addresses modal may not be
>> required, it depends if you want to allow the user to delete a
>> contact while the same contact is open in the edit form.
> Simple way around that. Put the delete button in the editing window.
>> It probably wont harm something in this case but it may in others.
> /me coughs in a manner that sounds very much like the words "use
>> The problem starts in the edit form, if you want yet to open another
>> window, lets say you want to attach a file to the address which is
>> opened in the edit window, within the opened edit window you open a
>> HTML File Manager. So you have 3 windows open, the address view in
>> the main web browser window, the edit form in a new window (without
> Every indication is that chromeless windows are on their way out.
I would be very sad if that would happen. Its currently the only way to
keep forms out of history and to unlock them from the back/next button.
So I would suggest to keep them and improve them rather than removing them.
> > and the File Manager in another
>> new window (without chrome). Wouldn't you use at least a modal window
>> in case when you open the File Manager, if modal Windows would exist?
> Assuming the address can only be deleted by opening it in an
> address editing window and pressing "delete", you have no use case in
> this situation, since the address can't be deleted until you return
> from the file manager. I would consider that this might be a problem
> in other situations, but I wonder if there aren't simple workarounds
> for it.
>> The File Manager is just one case, I face this problem many times
>> where for an external edit form it would be convenient to open a
>> modal sub window.
> So your use case for modal windows is that there are many
> convenient situations where you'd want to open a modal window...
>> So, Xforms may be a solution in that case if you don't require being
>> the first window you open to be modal. By the way, I am simulating
>> modal windows within the edit forms I use, but it is definitely a
>> dirty hack to simulate multi web browser and multi os modal windows.
> Yeah, hacks like this run the risk of conflicting with native UI
> conventions, I'll give you that. However, it is widely accepted that
> modal UI is to be avoided anyway.
I have no objection to avoid them if they are not really required.
Though what doing in the rare cases where you can't avoid them, I guess
Apple applications are still using modal windows in the one or other
case, and they will remain for another decade or two. Or is it different?
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