[whatwg] About <input type="hidden">
Ian Hickson
ian at hixie.ch
Tue Nov 11 17:11:19 PST 2008
(I've not replied to all the e-mails on this thread because they are
mostly redundant with this one. Please let me know if you made a point
regarding <input type=hidden> that you think needs changes to the spec
that I missed.)
On Fri, 17 Oct 2008, Mike Wilson wrote:
> Anne van Kesteren wrote:
> >
> > For the table and lists cases, is there a good use case for
> > complicating their content model
>
> This being a good or important use case is hard to say - I guess it is
> one of these real-world annoyances that both webdevs and browsers have
> learnt to cope with. As part of the HTML5 initiative is based on
> real-world browser behaviour I was thinking this may be a candidate for
> some spec adjustment in some form (maybe just defining graceful
> migration).
>
> > or could you just as well put the input either before or after the
> > table or list?
>
> For hand-coding I certainly could, I see no real reason to do what I
> suggest here when you are in control of the complete markup.
>
> But it gets harder for the scenario I was mentioning in my initial mail:
> [some incarnations of] server-side templating. Many templating systems
> work with the whole page at once to specify what markup to generate for
> specific data, but for more decoupled systems you may want to specify a
> HTML snippet per object type or similar - and then apply recursive view
> rendering on an object graph.
I agree, but it seems that having the hidden inputs be inside the next
<li> of a list, or the next <td>, or whatever is appropriate, isn't much
to ask for.
> Andy Lyttle wrote:
> > This is something I wanted to do recently. I was building HTML in a
> > Perl script, adding table rows in a loop, and I wanted some rows to
> > contain text field with user-editable value, while for other rows I
> > wanted the value to be displayed but not editable
>
> Yes, this is sort of similar to my scenario above, and you were able to
> workaround it being in control of the whole markup in one place (and not
> completely decoupled as I describe above). I think this is one of those
> things that webdevs keep hitting every now and then, and it is caused by
> a kind of inter- mingling of document structure and POSTable state in
> HTML/DOM.
For Perl, it's definitely possible (and relatively easy) to just store the
hidden inputs until the next suitable place (e.g. the next cell).
> Assuming you are in control of the whole page's markup at once then I
> agree. But when you are not and, it may be far from trivial. (I
> mentioned an example of this in the link I included earlier.)
I don't really follow why it's so hard in that case, but maybe you should
use a better templating language. :-)
> Ian wrote:
> > > - keeping the whole thing invalid but still define in HTML5 how
> > > the migration of ill-placed <input>:s should work
> >
> > That is theoretically already defined.
>
> Interesting. Is it the foster-parenting of tables you are referring to,
> or is there anything more specific for <input>:s?
Yes, foster parenting, and also the form element pointer, etc.
--
Ian Hickson U+1047E )\._.,--....,'``. fL
http://ln.hixie.ch/ U+263A /, _.. \ _\ ;`._ ,.
Things that are impossible just take longer. `._.-(,_..'--(,_..'`-.;.'
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