[whatwg] [html5] Rendering of interactive content

Giovanni Campagna scampa.giovanni at gmail.com
Sat Feb 7 10:51:33 PST 2009

2009/2/7 Benjamin Hawkes-Lewis <bhawkeslewis at googlemail.com>

> On 7/2/09 14:22, Giovanni Campagna wrote:
>>     > 5) becss requires "one or more binding languages": it is not
>>    necessarily
>>     > XBL2, but currently XBL2 is the only one available: are you
>>    constraining
>>     > the implementation of HTML5 on that of XBL2?
>>    The rendering section has no actual requirements in it, so nothing is
>>    constrained. Furthermore, nothing requires the binding language used by
>>    the UA to actually be a real language, so long as it is triggered by
>> the
>>    'binding' property.
>> "A number of elements have their rendering defined in terms of the
>> 'binding' property" (HTML5, with normative reference to BECSS)
>> No BECSS --> no rendering --> no interoperability
> The introduction to the rendering section says:
> 'User agents are not required present HTML documents in any particular way.
> However, this section provides a set of suggestions for rendering HTML
> documents that, if followed, are likely to lead to a user experience that
> closely resembles the experience intended by the documents' authors. So as
> to avoid confusion regarding the normativity of this section, RFC2119 terms
> have not been used. Instead, the term "expected" is used to indicate
> behavior that will lead to this experience.'
> http://www.whatwg.org/specs/web-apps/current-work/#rendering
> So the rendering section imposes *no* requirements on HTML5 conforming user
> agents, therefore the spec is not "constraining the implementation of HTML5
> on that of XBL2".

Yes, but UA that don't follow that set of CSS rules are not interoperable
with UA that follow, ie scripts must detect what properties are ignored or

> Furthermore, user agents are free to use any method they like to mimic the
> suggested rendering, including CSS3 UI where applicable. They don't have to
> use BE CSS at all.

They're "expected" to use CSS, and I expect that, according to html5,
"button { binding: initial; }" makes it like a <span>.

> If this is not obvious from the text, perhaps you would like to suggest a
> change to the text that would make it clearer?

I don't agree with rendering being "optional". If interoperability is so
important (and it is), rendering should be normative. Obviously I'm not
asking to depend on CSS, I'm asking that "UA should act if the following CSS
was specified" (even if it doesn't support CSS)

> --
> Benjamin Hawkes-Lewis
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